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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 07:09 |
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Thanks, Reenie, the word "anti-oxidant" is all I need to know.
You don't want to mess with 'oxidants' or 'anti-oxidants'. Folk who simplify the behavior of the body to terms as simple as these really don't understand what they are talking about.
I have suggested warm water sweetened with Splenda, perhaps adding the Jasmine Green Tea from Trader Joes, allowed to steep only for about 15 seconds, until just a little bit of flavor is added to the water.
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maggie weeks
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 07:14 |
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| Thanks Trevor I will switch to Green tea at once. I have some already but I loved the flavour of Rooibos so much what a shame, it has been bad to drink it after 2 years of thinking I was SO good to give up my regular cuppa!
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Bartonella muscle pain weak pelvic instab neck instab Lumbar nerve demyl occip headaches thoracic pain| Clonazepam Celexa 40mg| CutD&light 5/05| BeniQ6H Oct05| 1,25D=54 25D=29/ Apr06 25D=15| Mino Nov05| Phase 2 Apr06
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 07:31 |
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Keep it very, very weak, Maggie. Steep about 15 seconds. Trader Joe's Jasmine Green transfers just a hint of color and flavor to the water, and shouldn't give you any problems, while efficiently 'washing down' the Benicar and keeping those kidneys flushed...
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Kas
Member in Phase 2
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 07:39 |
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I have been drinking Rooibos tea for years. It comes from South Africa and is filled with anti- oxidants is and safe enough to give to babies when cooled. It contains no caffeine whatsoever, and once you get used it, it makes for a very pleasant beverage. It is also contained in some creams and is apparently beneficial in the topical treatment of minor skin ailments and wrinkles!
Just seen Trevor''s comment, so will now switch to weak Green tea! Another treat on hold until recovery....
Last edited on Wed Mar 12th, 2008 07:41 by Kas
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Sarc Dx by splenectomy 03- Lungs, lymph nodes, liver. Non MP meds: natural progesterone cream three weeks a month; cal/mag; probiotics; milk thistle daily; cranberry caps prn; quercetin prn.Noirs outdoors and under flourescent work lights, Spectra 3 cream
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maggie weeks
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 08:21 |
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| Thanks for your care and concern.Just had some sad news, my bridsmaid has just died of cancer. Thanks to the MP I am holding up as well as can be expected, years ago I would have been a total basket case, it has really helped me with my emotions and stress.
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Bartonella muscle pain weak pelvic instab neck instab Lumbar nerve demyl occip headaches thoracic pain| Clonazepam Celexa 40mg| CutD&light 5/05| BeniQ6H Oct05| 1,25D=54 25D=29/ Apr06 25D=15| Mino Nov05| Phase 2 Apr06
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appledrummer
Member
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 23:39 |
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So sorry to hear of your news Maggie.
I was just reading the latest comments about Rooibos tea. I have several friends (South African and British) who drink Rooibos and love it. But when I started to drink it ten years ago I found myself having awful stomach cramps. I have IBS (well I think that's what it is - never diagnosed by doctor) and wondered what was going on. After I had drunk about five cups and realised I was getting the same crippling cramps each time, I gave the box away to someone else! I have often mentioned this to people who 'swear by it' as a healthy option - they just look at me as tho I'm a nutter.
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Dx Fibromyalgia with chronic fatigue, photosensitivity. Dec 2007 Cut D intake, NoIRs, avoiding light. Stopped taking pulsed Allacin Max after nine months. Soon to start MP.
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maggie weeks
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Posted: Fri Mar 14th, 2008 22:25 |
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| Excuse my ignorance but what have you found that is SO harmful in Antioxidants. In all my reading they are touted at attacking the free radicals in our body and freeing them up and preventing aging etc etc. Is it just that us folks with the TH1 inflammtory disease that cannot process them. Can "healthy" people eat food that are high in antioxidants ie pomegranates. I have aways had a quarter of a cup of blueberries everyday for years with my oatmeal and drink small quantities of of pomegranite juice ie 1/4 cup.Is is the same as a little in moderation or is there a scientic molecular reason we should'nt be ingesting these in small amounts. Thanks for your imput
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Bartonella muscle pain weak pelvic instab neck instab Lumbar nerve demyl occip headaches thoracic pain| Clonazepam Celexa 40mg| CutD&light 5/05| BeniQ6H Oct05| 1,25D=54 25D=29/ Apr06 25D=15| Mino Nov05| Phase 2 Apr06
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 01:58 |
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Maggie,
Please show me one of your 'free radicals'. Then I will take another look at these silly, simplistic, and ineffective anti-oxidant theories.
Highly polar molecules will instantly bond to the nearest protein, enzyme, etc. They will not wait around for a Vitamin C, or other 'anti-oxidant' molecule to pass by.
Concentrated fruit juices, especially those which need to be repeated daily, are almost certainly acting as immunosupressants in Th1 compromised individuals.
Last edited on Sat Mar 15th, 2008 02:30 by Dr Trevor Marshall
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Twilight
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 02:03 |
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Carricol wrote: Back to the coffee issue. There are a number of specialty coffees that are advertized as low acid. Does anyone know if these are low in chlorogenec acid or have the majority of the chlorogenec acid removed?
I would really like to know the answer to this too, if anyone knows. Thanks. 
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Lyme CFS IBS 125d 53 25d8 Acyclovir (HSV1 of cornea) probiotics dig enz mag NoIRs housebound lo lux Ph1Jul07 Ph2Nov07 abx brk Feb08 r/t KFTs
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shandym
Member
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 02:45 |
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is it ok to have the daily cup of OJ without D of course or Pom juice? I have eliminated these from my diet but would love to have the daily glass in the morning. My diet is not very good and would like to get some form of vitamins.
Also is weight watchers sugar free soda ok to drink?
INGREDIENTS: Crystal clear carbonated water, natural and artificial flavors, citric acid,potassium benzoate, spelenda, acesulfame potassium,red#40,caramel color and blue #1
I dont mean to drink this in excess but would a can a day be too much for someone on the MP???
Thanks very much!
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FM like Pain, disequalibrium,vertigo, constant dizziness, palpitations, tachycardia, visual disturbances,headpressure/headpain 125D29, 25D7, MP 11/07, TUMS, Valium, NoIRs, limited outings covered up
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 03:16 |
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Shandy,
A cup of OJ is fine. One or two cans of that drink, assuming that there are no ingredients other than those listed, should also do no harm.
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shandym
Member
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 03:39 |
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Thank you!!
Those were the only ingredients listed....
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FM like Pain, disequalibrium,vertigo, constant dizziness, palpitations, tachycardia, visual disturbances,headpressure/headpain 125D29, 25D7, MP 11/07, TUMS, Valium, NoIRs, limited outings covered up
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maggie weeks
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 04:12 |
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| So if I am correct there is NO scientific proof done to support the theory of Free raidcals and antioxidants ?Why is there so much confusing information out there or is it a way to sell products and supplements which support this supposed theory.
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Bartonella muscle pain weak pelvic instab neck instab Lumbar nerve demyl occip headaches thoracic pain| Clonazepam Celexa 40mg| CutD&light 5/05| BeniQ6H Oct05| 1,25D=54 25D=29/ Apr06 25D=15| Mino Nov05| Phase 2 Apr06
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 05:17 |
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Maggie,
The talk about oxidants and anti-oxidants is a model. A way of trying to describe what a group of people thought was going on in the body. These days, about the only ones who continue to espouse it are those selling supplements. Molecular discovery has long made the whole concept look ridiculous.
The cytoplasm of a cell, where the Th1 pathogens have their metagenomic communities, also consists of literally thousands of molecules drifting around, bumping into other proteins, other peptides, and drugs, bonding with the ones which have sufficient attractive force. Then those bonds are in turn broken by higher affinity bonding to a different protein which comes by, or by 'conduction' into receptor binding pockets.
When I simulated how 1,25-D was pulled into the binding pocket of the VDR, I began to realize how mind-boggling is the number of molecular interactions which never evolve into anything biologically useful. You might wonder why you need to take Benicar so frequently. Once it is in the binding pocket of the VDR, surely it will stay there for ever? No - firstly the VDR itself is in constant motion - second, that motion is affected by the forces on the VDR from adjacent molecules. Olmesartan has an ability to stay in that binding pocket for only a few hours before it is either ejected, the VDR itself is pulled apart by outside forces, or an aggregation disables transcriptional capability.
High-school physics and chemistry, and even undergraduate physics and chemistry, do not prepare us for the reality of 21st Century Medicine. It is going to take several generations of med-school graduates before a better understanding evolves, I fear...
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maggie weeks
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 05:50 |
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| Thanks so much for taking the time with the explanation, as I am in the medical profession I do come across people wanting to sell supplements and they have supposedly back up trials to quote, so it could be confusing to the general public who are after a quick cure for various ailments . They are also promoting anti aging benefits when taken everyday. I am so glad I have been able to get this straightened out. I have been approached by several people in the medical profession who are touting products which can shrink tumours and help diabetes etc etc and it would be wonderful if it were that simple.
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Bartonella muscle pain weak pelvic instab neck instab Lumbar nerve demyl occip headaches thoracic pain| Clonazepam Celexa 40mg| CutD&light 5/05| BeniQ6H Oct05| 1,25D=54 25D=29/ Apr06 25D=15| Mino Nov05| Phase 2 Apr06
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jcwat101
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Posted: Sat Mar 15th, 2008 07:59 |
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There have been some studies lately showing anti oxidants not living up to previous expectations. I'm thinking of vitamin E and beta carotene/vitamin A, at the moment, but there are others.
Joyce Waterhouse
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20 yrs with CFS/FM/Lyme/IBS, food sensitivities; 1,25D/25D 8/04:64/11 http://SynergyHN.com
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Santa Monica
Member in Phase 3
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Posted: Tue Mar 18th, 2008 08:34 |
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A question:
If CA is in tomatoes, would tomato sauces be a no-no? I hate tomatoes and never eat them fresh, but I love a good tomato pasta sauce (with whole grain pasta, of course), and salsa fresca (the only "fresh" tomato I'll eat -- a real California girl takes advantage of all the great Mexican food here).
I made a pasta sauce tonight with canned chopped tomatoes and canned sauce (all organic and natural), along with lots of fresh ingredients.
I drink maybe one cup of coffee a week, and usually stick to herbal teas (peppermint, chamomile, sleepytime), so I avoid other sources of CA.
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Sarcoidosis/lungs CFS Hashimoto's 125D43 25D24 Armour Lunesta Ph1Mar08 25D32(Apr08) Ph2May08 abx brk r/t UTI restart Ph2Jun08 NoIRs low lux home lite exp r/t work 25D19 1,25D54 (8/28/08) brkDec08 wedding restart Ph2Jan09, Ph3 Mar09, 25D14(7/1/09)
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jcwat101
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Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 08:13 |
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There isn't that much chlorogenic acid in tomatoes. I don't think the FAQ says one really needs to worry about the levels in foods. It mainly says just don't drink more than a cup of coffee a day. So, go ahead and have tomatoes
Joyce Waterhouse
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20 yrs with CFS/FM/Lyme/IBS, food sensitivities; 1,25D/25D 8/04:64/11 http://SynergyHN.com
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wrotek
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Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 20:33 |
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Hmmm, is this true ?
Coffee contains potent opiate receptor binding activity
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v301/n5897/abs/301246a0.html
Isolation of opiate receptor ligands in coffee.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2832110?dopt=Abstract
Last edited on Wed Mar 19th, 2008 20:42 by wrotek
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 21:30 |
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Good find, Wrotek. Those studies look OK (at first glance).
"with no significant difference between normal and decaffeinated coffee"
Hmm.. that seems to mirror what members have been reporting here.
Note that the opioid receptors are expressed on Lymphocytes, and are therefore active in the immune system, in ways yet to be properly defined.
Finally, Olmesartan appears to be active in the opioid-delta receptor, with about the same level of affinity as Naloxone. But it docks into a different part of the receptor binding pocket, and its actions are therefore totally unknown. I haven't looked really closely.
..trevor..
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